After graduating from a seminary in Taiwan, Brother L returned to Baiyuwan Church, a rural church in his hometown in the Zhejiang Province, to serve in January 2021. In the previous interview, he shared about the ministry he carried out in the rural church and how he viewed the aging of the rural church.
At present, Brother L is the only full-time pastor at Baiyuwan Church. He does not only have to pastor and visit members but also has to train the group leaders. His life is busy but fulfilling.
In this article, he recalled how he led the rural church into a group pastoral church for a year with the Gospel Times, an online Chinese Christian newspaper.
Gospel Times: When did your church get started with pastoral care in small groups?
Brother L: When I just came back from Taiwan, we couldn’t meet in the church because of the COVID-19 pandemic. I thought, am I going to pastor like a streamer, or am I going to pastor in some other way? Online gatherings are okay, but the fear of God is missing, because some people listen while lying in bed, some tune in while washing clothes, and some have ears on the live-streaming service when chopping and cooking vegetables. From the point of view of pandemic prevention, we Christians should do our part, but we can’t please God if we don’t meet, because He tells us not to stop meeting. In this context, I want to start pastoral care in small groups.
I have seen that Taiwanese churches have carried out pastoral care in small groups for decades, but it is difficult for our traditional churches to hold group meetings. It is a matter of habit. So how should we start? In the beginning, I was not in a hurry to start the groups. I held vision talks on Sunday and then shared the plan of pastoral care in small groups at the meeting with the administrative board. I started with these two steps.
Firstly, I made the vision of pastoral care in small groups visible to more people, which is a bit like the process of loosening the soil. Then I spent half a year training team leaders twice a week. The lecturer was me alone, and the participants included church volunteers, committee members, and believers who wanted to help. In September 2021, the group leaders who have been trained officially began to lead the groups.
Gospel Times: So how many churches have this small group training?
Brother L: It is conducted in two churches. One church has a congregation of 300-500 people, which is the church I grew up in. The other church has a membership of around 150. It is the Baiyuwan church that I’m managing now.
Gospel Times: How did it go?
Brother L: As I’m in a rural church, when we started, many elders in the church thought, “Oh, this is not for us.” “Urban churches can do it, but our rural churches can’t.” I was a little frustrated at first. I wanted to be in a church with many young people, but I was already in a rural church. So I prayed to God for this.
Three months after the group training, the elders of the church gradually changed. At first, they said that pastoral care in small groups was not suitable for our church. Then, they said that the small group was good. After that, they started to say that our church should also have small groups. At the end of the day, an old man said, “I’m 80 years old. Can I be a team leader?” I saw an elder with swollen feet, but he still participated in the group training. I was very moved.
Gospel Times: They initially felt that the small group was not suitable for rural churches. What were their considerations?
Brother L: Firstly, they thought that they are busy with farm work and cannot spare time to study and lead a group. Secondly, there are not many people in the church who have attended schools, so they cannot learn or lead a group.
Gospel Times: How were those two issues resolved later?
Brother L: I taught them step by step and shared with them word by word, as long as they had the burden to carry on and are literate. For example, I may use four classes in my church to teach what I can teach in one class when I teach in an urban church. It is not how much I speak, but how much these brothers and sisters can understand. If they don’t understand, I’ll stop and practice my patience.
Let me tell you an interesting story. On a Sunday, I went to a church to preach and share my vision. The church stopped meeting since the outbreak of the pandemic, and after listening to my vision, we had a meeting at noon and directly decided the division of the groups. That afternoon, the elders of the church asked me to talk for an hour and a half about how to do pastoral care in small groups.
Therefore, you can’t arbitrarily say that some thing cannot be developed or used in the rural areas. As a pastor, you must be willing to pass on visions and patiently share them with the elders. There’s the influence of the Holy Spirit, but people also have to pay a price with their effort.
Gospel Times: How did it go after that?
Brother L: When the pandemic broke out in Ningbo, the local requirement was that there should be less than 10 people at each meeting. So we went from a group meeting to a family meeting, which was a step further. Then the reserve group leaders stepped up as team leaders.
The work of the reserve group leaders was even better than original group leaders because they had spent a lot of time in training. Some people were busy preparing lessons and even had no time for eating.
I’m really grateful for their work. I remember last Christmas, every brother and sister in the group came to worship. I thought to myself, “Wow, there are so many benefits about the pastoral care in small groups.” The performance of a band formed by an old man and a child touched all the people. The old man played the huqin, a spike fiddle popularly used in Chinese music, and a young child, about four or five, sang the song God Loves Everyone.
Gospel Times: Are there any issues that need to be addressed now?
Brother L: The current problem is that the pastoral team is not formed. That means the church doesn’t have full-time pastors. They are all volunteers. However, the voluntary work is also heavy, and there is work to be done at their homes, so the church can not start many things at once.
Gospel Times: How is the pastoral care in small groups in the church with 300 to 500 people going?
Brother L: That church has a group leader, but there is no parish leader. Many of the group leaders are very stressed.
They don’t have a day to pass on the vision. They just say they must do pastoral care in small groups but they don’t know how to do it. Some adopt the mode of fellowship, while some gather in small groups. But on the whole, the delivery of the vision is not successful.
Since that church is my mother church, the brothers and sisters there have been so kind to help me, I really want to help it. Their church council and full-time pastors are also supportive of my pastoral care campaign in small groups.
The prototype of our church small group is already in place, so I will spend some time helping this church.
- Translated by Nicolas Cao
L弟兄在台湾神学毕业之后，2021年1月份回到浙江家乡农村教会白玉湾教会侍奉，在一年多的时间里带领该教会转型成为小组牧养的教会。
目前，L弟兄是白玉湾教会唯一一名全职传道人。平时既要牧养又要探访，还要培训小组长，忙碌且充实。
L弟兄向福音时报讲述了他回到农村教会这一年侍奉的历程。
福音时报：你们教会是在什么情况下开始小组牧养的？
L弟兄：我刚刚从台湾回来的时候，那时候因为疫情就已经不能聚会了。我就想，我是要像当主播一样地来牧养呢，还是说用其他的方式呢？线上聚会的话是可以的，但是缺少了对上帝的敬畏之心，因为有的人躺在被窝里听道，有的人一边洗衣服一边听，有的人一边切菜、煮菜，一边听。从防疫的角度，我们基督徒应该要做好本分。但是呢，不聚会又不讨上帝喜悦，上帝叫我们不要停止聚会。在这个背景下，我就想要开展小组牧养。
我看到台湾教会开展小组牧养已经好几十年了，而我们的传统教会要做小组聚会很难，是观念问题。那怎么办呢？开始我不急着开展小组，我就在主日进行异象传递，然后在堂委会的时候分享小组的计划，我是从这两个步骤开始的。
先去进行异象传递，使更多人看到小组牧养的愿景，这有点像松土的过程。然后，我花了半年的时间培训小组长，每周两次。讲师是我一个人，参与学习的有教会义工、堂委以及有负担的弟兄姊妹。2021年9月份，经过培训的小组长正式开始带小组。
福音时报：在几个教会开展小组培训？
L弟兄：在两个教会开展，一个教会聚会人数300-500人，是我从小成长的教会；一个教会聚会人数150人左右，是我的本堂白玉湾教会。
福音时报：开展得顺利吗？
L弟兄：因为我是在农村的教会，刚开始开展的时候，很多教会的长辈们都觉得，“哎呀，这个不适合我们啊。”“城市教会可以开展，我们农村教会是不可以的。”我刚开始也是有点灰心，我也想在年轻人多的教会呀，但是已经来了农村教会，然后就为此祷告。
小组培训进行了一个月、两个月、三个月以后，教会的长辈们逐渐有改变。他们刚开始说小组牧养不适合我们教会；到第二次呢，说小组挺好的；到第三次呢，就说我们教会也要开展小组；再到最后呢，说我80岁了，我是否可以当小组长啊？我看到有一个长辈脚肿得很大，但是他都参加小组的培训，我就非常感动。
福音时报：他们最初觉得小组不适合农村教会，他们的考虑是怎样的？
L弟兄：他们的考虑，第一是农活忙，抽不出时间学习带小组；第二是教会有知识文化的人不多，学不来，带不了小组。
福音时报：后来这两个问题是怎么解决的？
L弟兄：我是手把手一个字一个字教，一句一句分享，只要你有负担、识字的人来学习就可以。比如说我去城市教会讲课，一堂课就能讲完的内容，在我本堂我要花四堂课的时间。需要讲得更精细，不在于我讲的多少，而在于弟兄姐妹们能听多少。他们不懂的，我就停下来，也是操练我的耐心吧。
讲一个趣事啊，有个星期天，我去一个教会讲道进行异象传递，这个教会从疫情来了就停止聚会了，然后听我讲了异象传递以后，中午就开会，直接分小组聚会了。当天下午，这个教会的长辈们又让我讲一个半小时关于如何做小组牧养。
所以，有些东西不是说农村的教会就没法开展或没法用，而是作为牧者你是否愿意去做异象传递，耐心地跟长辈们分享。有圣灵的感动，但是人也要付代价。
福音时报：之后的进展如何？
L弟兄：后来我们宁波有了疫情，当地的要求是聚会一定要10个人以下。所以我们就从小组聚会转型成以家庭为单位的聚会，相当于是进一步转型了。然后那些预备小组长也站出来做小组长。
预备小组长带的效果比老的组长带的还要好，因为他们花了很多的时间去参加培训。有的人不吃饭也在备课，花了很多的代价。
很感恩，我记得去年圣诞节的时候，小组里的每个弟兄姐妹都来献诗来敬拜。我就觉得“哇，原来小组有这么多好处。”有一个老少搭配让人很感动，一个长辈拉胡琴，一个四五岁的小孩唱《神爱世人》。
福音时报：现在还有什么需要解决的问题吗？
L弟兄：目前的问题是教牧团队没有形成。就是说教会没有全职的人来牧养，都是义工们在牧养。但是义工工作也忙，家里面有活要干，所以教会很多事情不能马上开展。
福音时报：300-500人的那间教会小组牧养进展如何？
L弟兄：300-500人的那间教会有小组长，但是没有区牧长，也没有区长，很多组长带得很有压力。
他们那边没有主日异象传递，只是说有负担做小组牧养，但不知道怎么做。有的是团契模式的，有的是小组模式的，整体来说转型不成功。
那间教会是我的母会，是我从小长大的教会。弟兄姐妹很有爱心，一直帮助我，所以我对那间教会有负担。他们教会的堂委、全职传道，也都支持让我来帮他们把小组牧养做起来。
我们本堂小组牧养的雏形已经建好，所以我会花些时间帮助这一间教会。
我在农村教会侍奉这一年（一）：传统教会向小组牧养转型
After graduating from a seminary in Taiwan, Brother L returned to Baiyuwan Church, a rural church in his hometown in the Zhejiang Province, to serve in January 2021. In the previous interview, he shared about the ministry he carried out in the rural church and how he viewed the aging of the rural church.
At present, Brother L is the only full-time pastor at Baiyuwan Church. He does not only have to pastor and visit members but also has to train the group leaders. His life is busy but fulfilling.
In this article, he recalled how he led the rural church into a group pastoral church for a year with the Gospel Times, an online Chinese Christian newspaper.
Gospel Times: When did your church get started with pastoral care in small groups?
Brother L: When I just came back from Taiwan, we couldn’t meet in the church because of the COVID-19 pandemic. I thought, am I going to pastor like a streamer, or am I going to pastor in some other way? Online gatherings are okay, but the fear of God is missing, because some people listen while lying in bed, some tune in while washing clothes, and some have ears on the live-streaming service when chopping and cooking vegetables. From the point of view of pandemic prevention, we Christians should do our part, but we can’t please God if we don’t meet, because He tells us not to stop meeting. In this context, I want to start pastoral care in small groups.
I have seen that Taiwanese churches have carried out pastoral care in small groups for decades, but it is difficult for our traditional churches to hold group meetings. It is a matter of habit. So how should we start? In the beginning, I was not in a hurry to start the groups. I held vision talks on Sunday and then shared the plan of pastoral care in small groups at the meeting with the administrative board. I started with these two steps.
Firstly, I made the vision of pastoral care in small groups visible to more people, which is a bit like the process of loosening the soil. Then I spent half a year training team leaders twice a week. The lecturer was me alone, and the participants included church volunteers, committee members, and believers who wanted to help. In September 2021, the group leaders who have been trained officially began to lead the groups.
Gospel Times: So how many churches have this small group training?
Brother L: It is conducted in two churches. One church has a congregation of 300-500 people, which is the church I grew up in. The other church has a membership of around 150. It is the Baiyuwan church that I’m managing now.
Gospel Times: How did it go?
Brother L: As I’m in a rural church, when we started, many elders in the church thought, “Oh, this is not for us.” “Urban churches can do it, but our rural churches can’t.” I was a little frustrated at first. I wanted to be in a church with many young people, but I was already in a rural church. So I prayed to God for this.
Three months after the group training, the elders of the church gradually changed. At first, they said that pastoral care in small groups was not suitable for our church. Then, they said that the small group was good. After that, they started to say that our church should also have small groups. At the end of the day, an old man said, “I’m 80 years old. Can I be a team leader?” I saw an elder with swollen feet, but he still participated in the group training. I was very moved.
Gospel Times: They initially felt that the small group was not suitable for rural churches. What were their considerations?
Brother L: Firstly, they thought that they are busy with farm work and cannot spare time to study and lead a group. Secondly, there are not many people in the church who have attended schools, so they cannot learn or lead a group.
Gospel Times: How were those two issues resolved later?
Brother L: I taught them step by step and shared with them word by word, as long as they had the burden to carry on and are literate. For example, I may use four classes in my church to teach what I can teach in one class when I teach in an urban church. It is not how much I speak, but how much these brothers and sisters can understand. If they don’t understand, I’ll stop and practice my patience.
Let me tell you an interesting story. On a Sunday, I went to a church to preach and share my vision. The church stopped meeting since the outbreak of the pandemic, and after listening to my vision, we had a meeting at noon and directly decided the division of the groups. That afternoon, the elders of the church asked me to talk for an hour and a half about how to do pastoral care in small groups.
Therefore, you can’t arbitrarily say that some thing cannot be developed or used in the rural areas. As a pastor, you must be willing to pass on visions and patiently share them with the elders. There’s the influence of the Holy Spirit, but people also have to pay a price with their effort.
Gospel Times: How did it go after that?
Brother L: When the pandemic broke out in Ningbo, the local requirement was that there should be less than 10 people at each meeting. So we went from a group meeting to a family meeting, which was a step further. Then the reserve group leaders stepped up as team leaders.
The work of the reserve group leaders was even better than original group leaders because they had spent a lot of time in training. Some people were busy preparing lessons and even had no time for eating.
I’m really grateful for their work. I remember last Christmas, every brother and sister in the group came to worship. I thought to myself, “Wow, there are so many benefits about the pastoral care in small groups.” The performance of a band formed by an old man and a child touched all the people. The old man played the huqin, a spike fiddle popularly used in Chinese music, and a young child, about four or five, sang the song God Loves Everyone.
Gospel Times: Are there any issues that need to be addressed now?
Brother L: The current problem is that the pastoral team is not formed. That means the church doesn’t have full-time pastors. They are all volunteers. However, the voluntary work is also heavy, and there is work to be done at their homes, so the church can not start many things at once.
Gospel Times: How is the pastoral care in small groups in the church with 300 to 500 people going?
Brother L: That church has a group leader, but there is no parish leader. Many of the group leaders are very stressed.
They don’t have a day to pass on the vision. They just say they must do pastoral care in small groups but they don’t know how to do it. Some adopt the mode of fellowship, while some gather in small groups. But on the whole, the delivery of the vision is not successful.
Since that church is my mother church, the brothers and sisters there have been so kind to help me, I really want to help it. Their church council and full-time pastors are also supportive of my pastoral care campaign in small groups.
The prototype of our church small group is already in place, so I will spend some time helping this church.
- Translated by Nicolas Cao
Interview: The Transition from Traditional Church to Small Groups
